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Thread: Random news of the day

  1. #721
    This Space For Hire aleandhearty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldboots View Post
    I hesitate to post this link, it is in a similar but more basic vein and it was on Boak & Bailey's blog however it's not for the faint-hearted

    http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/deep-...b-piss-dungeon
    I'm sure the guy saw lots of drawbacks in what he was doing. Was it the means to an end?.............Brings whole new meaning to the phrases 'going for a warm shower' and 'being in a plum position'.
    'And where he supped the past lived still. And where he sipped the glass brimmed full' John Barleycorn, Carol Ann Duffy.

  2. #722
    Palookaville hondo's Avatar
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    "Do I know where hell is? hell is in hello"

  3. #723
    Old & Bitter oldboots's Avatar
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    Why CAMRA is wrong about minimum pricing

    http://www.morningadvertiser.co.uk/G...ng-for-alcohol

    what Ian said.

  4. #724
    Pub researcher (unpaid) rpadam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldboots View Post
    Why CAMRA is wrong about minimum pricing

    http://www.morningadvertiser.co.uk/G...ng-for-alcohol

    what Ian said.
    Leaving aside what Tim Martin said for a minute...

    "Speaking at the Association of Licensed Multiple Retailers (ALMR) conference in London, Payne said it’s “the worst thing that could happen to the industry”, and giving the Government control of prices is “asking for trouble”. Sounds reasonable so far.

    He compared it to the situation with university tuition fees, that were initially set at £2,000 by the previous Government and have now reached as much as £9,000. Fair enough.

    The Government has proposed a 40p minimum unit price and Payne said: “All of a sudden 40p is £4. A bit over the top, but I take his point.

    “To set something at 40/50p that at the moment seems very good for the industry at some stage down the line if we give the Government control of retail prices it will hurt you.” That's certainly a risk.

    "I think we should be lobbying for what we can achieve,” he stressed, calling for the industry to argue for bans on bulk alcohol deals in supermarkets and the the right of supermarkets to advertise cut-price alcohol in newspapers."

    What!

    Having identified the risk in encouraging the Government to interfere in pricing, is it really very sensible to start encouraging them to introduce new blanket bans?

    To paraphrase:
    "All of a sudden a ban on the the right of supermarkets to advertise cut-price alcohol in newspapers is a ban on... the right of pubs to advertise?"

    or even
    "All of a sudden a ban on bulk alcohol deals in supermarkets is a ban on... alcohol?"

    Back to Tim...

    Martin called minimum pricing a “red herring” and urged the industry to lobby for a VAT cut for the sector instead.

    “We in the industry are very slow to pick up on this point. If the tax structure doesn’t change there’s no doubt in my mind there will be fewer pubs.”

    However, Payne said the industry doesn’t have “a snowball’s chance in hell” of getting a VAT reduction.


    Quite!

    I think the industry need to do a bit better than this for the Government to take them seriously.

  5. #725
    Old & Bitter oldboots's Avatar
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    I quite agree with you RP on the supermarket point and that illustrates what is wrong with the pro drink side. The neo-pro's have a coherent and consistent position; our side is divided with pubs against supermarkets, BBPA against SIBA, Bloggers against boring brown bitter, SIBA against Regionals, lager V cask V craft, old mens pubs V bright trendy bars and just about everyone against CAMRA.

    I've dug out my homebrew kit against the coming day.

  6. #726
    Pub researcher (unpaid) rpadam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldboots View Post
    I've dug out my homebrew kit against the coming day.
    I might have to get one myself!

  7. #727
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    As has been said, they need to do better than that. The main idea of minimum pricing is to tackle the unpleasantness of our town centres of a weekend by discouraging people from getting pissed up before they even arrive at Wetherspoon's Lloyd's No1s and Stonegate's Yates, Scream and Slug and Lettuces. It is a problem that causes considerable concern and won't go away of its own accord. It gives some sectors of the Trade a very bad name. There are other things that could be done, none of which would please the industry. Whacking up excise duty for instance, or radically changing the licensing regime for town centres.

    Yes the government could increase the minimum price to the point where it would stop Tim Martin loss leading GK IPA at £1.99 a pint. But at a quid a unit that would mean a £9 bottle of wine and £28 for a bottle of Scotch: I doubt that that would be politically acceptable anytime soon and in any case, the government could impose that through excise duty tomorrow if there was the will.

    I do wonder if they tacitly approve of 'pre-loading' because no-one in their right mind would enter a Scream or Yates stone cold sober.
    Last edited by NickDavies; 06-05-2012 at 12:53. Reason: grocery

  8. #728
    Fully paid up beer belly Farway's Avatar
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    A SPECIAL ale is being launched at the Winchester Beer Festival as a tribute to former Shadows bass guitarist Jet Harris.

    Daily Echo [Southampton]
    I drink to make others more interesting

  9. #729
    Old & Bitter oldboots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NickDavies View Post

    Yes the government could increase the minimum price to the point where it would stop Tim Martin loss leading GK IPA at £1.99 a pint. But at a quid a unit that would mean a £9 bottle of wine and £28 for a bottle of Scotch: I doubt that that would be politically acceptable anytime soon and in any case, the government could impose that through excise duty tomorrow if there was the will.
    Governments never achieve anything by sudden draconian measures, small steps followed by small steps, followed by nibbling away bit by bit.

    For example what does this statement mean? “...today I have no further changes to make to the duty rates set out by my predecessor. “

    Answer: 10p a pint duty increase this year and a 42% increase since 2008.

    I don't have the figures to prove £1.99 for a pint of GK IPA is a loss to Tim Martin but I'd be surprised if he sold anything below his purchase cost, my guess is JDW pay around £75 for a nine of GK IPA or Ruddles. Many wines are over £9 a bottle and a lot of whiskys are more than £28 a bottle already, so who's it not politically acceptable to? Blaming pre-loading suggests it's the first drink rather than the last that's to blame for any drunken behaviour, it is incidentally an offence to serve a drunk person with alcohol. I would also contend that high retail prices encourage preloading as well as smuggling and illict manufacture.

    The neo-pros work through misinformation: create a bogeyman through false hysterical stories about some phantom menance then attack it, then move on to the next group. The fact is alcohol consumption is falling and has been since at least 2002 and Home Office figures show alcohol related crime has fallen by 41% since 1995.

  10. #730
    Pussy Galore No 1 Oggwyn Trench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldboots View Post
    Governments never achieve anything by sudden draconian measures, small steps followed by small steps, followed by nibbling away bit by bit.

    For example what does this statement mean? “...today I have no further changes to make to the duty rates set out by my predecessor. “

    Answer: 10p a pint duty increase this year and a 42% increase since 2008.

    I don't have the figures to prove £1.99 for a pint of GK IPA is a loss to Tim Martin but I'd be surprised if he sold anything below his purchase cost, my guess is JDW pay around £75 for a nine of GK IPA or Ruddles. Many wines are over £9 a bottle and a lot of whiskys are more than £28 a bottle already, so who's it not politically acceptable to? Blaming pre-loading suggests it's the first drink rather than the last that's to blame for any drunken behaviour, it is incidentally an offence to serve a drunk person with alcohol. I would also contend that high retail prices encourage preloading as well as smuggling and illict manufacture.

    The neo-pros work through misinformation: create a bogeyman through false hysterical stories about some phantom menance then attack it, then move on to the next group. The fact is alcohol consumption is falling and has been since at least 2002 and Home Office figures show alcohol related crime has fallen by 41% since 1995.
    A 9 gallon of GK IPA is around £45 +vat , Ruddles is about the same , an 18 of Abbott is around a £100 + VAT and thats from a wholesaler taking their cut , direct from GK is cheaper (free trade not tied) i know one freehouse that has a deal with GK , buy 3 IPA and get a 9 of Abbott free .
    The most expensive of the main stream Casks is TT Landlord which is around £98 for a 9 gallon
    Wetherspoons wont pay anywhere near these prices
    Theres a Man with a Mullet going Mad with a Mallet in Millets !

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