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Thread: Yet another list

  1. #791
    This Space For Hire Aqualung's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rpadam View Post
    Historic England (or, more formally, the Historic Buildings and Monuments Commission for England) is accountable to the Secretary of State for Digital, Culture, Media & Sport. Commissioners are appointed by the Secretary of State, and the commission then appoints external members of its committees, panels and the Expert Advisory Group (should you wish to apply). Does that help? Probably not!
    It does help as it confirms my suspicion that it is unelected and unaccountable to the general public. I'm sure the Minister involved would never dream of taking any notice of lobbying by the larger pubcos or breweries.

  2. #792
    Old & Bitter oldboots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aqualung View Post
    It does help as it confirms my suspicion that it is unelected and unaccountable to the general public. I'm sure the Minister involved would never dream of taking any notice of lobbying by the larger pubcos or breweries.
    Certainly unelected, theoretically the accountability is via the politician who oversees it, so pretty much as accountable as most other things in Government. Gosh the idea that Ministers could be swayed by lobbying or other considerations, well I don't know what to say to such a suggestion.

    The thing with historic buildings is that it's a moving target subject to the whims of fashion, which is exactly why the public aren't and indeed shouldn't be involved in decisions. In the 19th Century our now almost universally loved Georgian buildings were almost universally loathed, in the mid-20th century Victorian buildings were thought of as ugly monstrosities, but who would dare to try and pull down St Pancras station now? The experts have the tough job of trying to save a representative selection of the best architecture but they have to predict what will be considered the best in the future. Of course listing doesn't always save a building, owners let them rot or they "go on fire", or they get demolished hours before the listing is confirmed, to name but three ways around a listing.

    Tell us, now, how and when
    We may find the bravest men?
    A sure test, an easy test:
    Those that drink beer are the best

  3. #793
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldboots View Post
    Certainly unelected, theoretically the accountability is via the politician who oversees it, so pretty much as accountable as most other things in Government. Gosh the idea that Ministers could be swayed by lobbying or other considerations, well I don't know what to say to such a suggestion.

    The thing with historic buildings is that it's a moving target subject to the whims of fashion, which is exactly why the public aren't and indeed shouldn't be involved in decisions. In the 19th Century our now almost universally loved Georgian buildings were almost universally loathed, in the mid-20th century Victorian buildings were thought of as ugly monstrosities, but who would dare to try and pull down St Pancras station now? The experts have the tough job of trying to save a representative selection of the best architecture but they have to predict what will be considered the best in the future. Of course listing doesn't always save a building, owners let them rot or they "go on fire", or they get demolished hours before the listing is confirmed, to name but three ways around a listing.
    Thanks for that substantial clarification. I'll try and lighten the tone of this (which for some reason seemed to get personal) and hopefully finish it with this thought.
    Michael Gove famously said that "Britain has had enough of experts", thereby claiming to be an expert on gauging the public's opinion of experts after which the public decided they'd had enough of him.

  4. #794
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aqualung View Post
    Michael Gove famously said that "Britain has had enough of experts", thereby claiming to be an expert on gauging the public's opinion of experts after which the public decided they'd had enough of him.
    If only we could express that in some way...
    Come On You Hatters!

  5. #795
    Old & Bitter oldboots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sheffield hatter View Post
    If only we could express that in some way...
    Nothing simpler

    1. Move to the Surrey Heath Constituency
    2. Persuade about 25,000 of those who voted for "oiky" Gove to vote for another candidate (preferably the same one)
    3. Enjoy the wonders of democracy

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    Quote Originally Posted by NickDavies View Post
    Five Historic post-war pubs given listed status


    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/in-pictures-44168220
    Bit late to the party but 2 Bath and Swindon.

  7. #797
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldboots View Post
    Nothing simpler

    1. Move to the Surrey Heath Constituency
    2. Persuade about 25,000 of those who voted for "oiky" Gove to vote for another candidate (preferably the same one)
    3. Enjoy the wonders of democracy
    You lost me at "Surrey". What part of Yorkshire is that in?

    He certainly is rather piggy-looking isn't he.

    Oh, "oiky" - sorry, must get some new glasses.
    Come On You Hatters!

  8. #798
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    Quote Originally Posted by sheffield hatter View Post
    You lost me at "Surrey". What part of Yorkshire is that in?
    You can only vote Oiky out if you live in his constituency, were you thinking of some other way?

    Tell us, now, how and when
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    A sure test, an easy test:
    Those that drink beer are the best

  9. #799
    This Space For Hire Aqualung's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldboots View Post
    You can only vote Oiky out if you live in his constituency, were you thinking of some other way?
    If it's any help VIZ called him a "guppy faced twat"!

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