One for the Londoners here - Are Antic in trouble ?

Went to pay a second visit to the Bohemia in North Finchley last night after it was reopened from an O'Neils by Antic last summer, only to find it shut and a group of the locals outside being photographed with banners (presumably for the local rag) to get it reopened.
And a bit of googling this morning has thrown up that it shut last week after Antic could not come to an agreement with the agent acting for the head lessor and were forced to close our doors as a result.
On the back of them being gazumped for one of their pubs in Walthamstow and a couple of other stories abounding about them loosing other lease deals, things don't look too rosie in the house of Antic..
Anyone got any more informed information ?

http://forums.pubsgalore.co.uk/showt...ighlight=antic

http://www.barnet-today.co.uk/news.c...ht%20to%20save

My answer to the original question is that I don't know.

There are several parts to this story.


The first part is that at the beginning of the year Antic split their estate into two and the smaller part consisting of just 12 pubs went into administration. This was then bought up by the Gregarious Pub Company (run by a former Antic member of staff!). The remaining Antic pubs are now all on the AnticLondon.com web site.

I don't know much about accountancy, but to me this smacks of a convenient arrangement dreamed up by an accountant.

The second part consists of the gazumping of the leasehold of two Antic pubs by Camden Bars, a company who specialise in rubbish music venue pubs in Camden Town and Hackney.

The first to go was the Chequers in Walthamstow Market. The first thing they did was to cut out weekday afternoon opening so they open at 17:00 Mon-Fri. I went there at Easter when it Was Antic and spotted a couple of interesting beers, one of which was in very good nick. To be honest I can't be bothered to return after what Camden Bars did.

About a month later the same thing happened to the Catford Bridge Tavern, whose closing down party is I believe this Sunday.

The third part concerns the Bohemia in Finchley. As the local rag article which Hondo refers to states, this is a simple case of M&B (a pub company that has it's origins in one of the old Big Six breweries) refusing to give Gregarious (the spin-off from Antic) a permanent lease. Why this should be so is anyone's guess.

I recently went to two new Antic pubs in East London and sadly both of them had a poor beer selection, but I believe that they need to set up a trading agreement with SIBA to allow them to get more interesting beers in. The Old George in Bethnal Green Road was fairly quiet, but the brand new Leyton Technical was pretty well rammed. It looked like they had spent a lot of money on doing it up.

I reckon they are a bit of a hit & miss outfit. Apart from the Antic London split fiasco, there are several other occasions where forthcoming pub openings have been advertised, but have not come to fruition. The Knowles in West Norwood, and the Greyhound in Sydenham are a couple of cases in point - there are others that don't spring to mind at the moment. They just don't give the impression of permanence. They do decent ale though.

I dont think Antic are in trouble as they have just had their own brewery fitted out in Camberwell.They seem to get short leases on pubs that others seem to steer clear of.By putting half the pubs into liquidation recently they should have cleared out the dead wood.

The Bohemia from above appears in the 2014 GBG, So much for the blurb on page 5 claiming that the GBG is not out of date as soon as it's published!! I'm sure the branch would not have included it if they knew Antic were likely to lose the lease.

The backboard outside this one says it's "part of the Antic Collective" - whatever that means.

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Originally Posted by NickDavies

The backboard outside this one says it's "part of the Antic Collective" - whatever that means.

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I think Antic Collective is what Antic Pub Co became after the accountants had ditched the twelve pubs and after becoming Antic London. According to their web page the Bohemia is still one of them!

"fighting to have the pub reopened said it they had held positive talks"
http://www.thisislocallondon.co.uk/N...se_occupation/

It looks like a another East London one is going to open soon, the bizarrely named Farr's School Of Dancing in Dalston Lane E8. It sounds like it's going to be more of a foody place than an ale house.

"Barnet Council’s register of assets of community value, which makes it more difficult for landlords to sell"
http://www.barnet-today.co.uk/news.c...munity%20asset'

"The Baring Hall Hotel in Grove Park, which was spared demolition in 2011 by a campaign started by local residents, will open its doors again on November 21"
http://www.eastlondonlines.co.uk/201...open-as-a-pub/

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Originally Posted by hondo

"The Baring Hall Hotel in Grove Park, which was spared demolition in 2011 by a campaign started by local residents, will open its doors again on November 21"
http://www.eastlondonlines.co.uk/201...open-as-a-pub/

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Desperately needed, as there doesn't seem to be another pub for miles. Interestingly, the report says that Antic have bought the pub which, if true, is a departure from their usual practice of taking (usually short) leases.

" would not say when the pub was closing or how many staff will lose their jobs"
http://www.wimbledonguardian.co.uk/n...r_in_business/

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Originally Posted by hondo

" would not say when the pub was closing or how many staff will lose their jobs"
http://www.wimbledonguardian.co.uk/n...r_in_business/

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Bit of a lame excuse.

"the shutters will come off the"
http://www.times-series.co.uk/news/1...ing_announced/

According to their web site Antic are planning opening unspecified pubs in Harlesden and Willesden Green, arguably the worst drinking area in the whole of Greater London. Spoons opened the Coliseum back in the 90s but gave up on it and I remember also going to a grotty Fuller's pub called the Green Man. I can't think of a pub with any merit whatsoever in the Willesden Green area,

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Originally Posted by Aqualung

According to their web site Antic are planning opening unspecified pubs in Harlesden and Willesden Green, arguably the worst drinking area in the whole of Greater London. Spoons opened the Coliseum back in the 90s but gave up on it and I remember also going to a grotty Fuller's pub called the Green Man. I can't think of a pub with any merit whatsoever in the Willesden Green area,

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I hope that one of them might be the Royal Oak - a run-down pub which still has some interesting features and one that somebody with a bit of imagination could do a decent job with.

I've never been in it, I always assumed it was an Irish pub. It is certainly an impressive building, but does Harlesden have tbe market for an Antic pub? I haven't been there for two or three years.

Two more Antic pubs in SW London closed in February (Provenance, Colliers Wood and Kings Head, Clapham, following close on the heels of the Battersea Mess and Music Hall, and with The Wheatsheaf at Tooting Bec under serious threat. It doesn't really pay to get too attached to their pubs in my part of the world. They seem to be taking these short leases from the big boys, I suspect in the knowledge that they won't be long lived establishments in some cases. Just babysitting them some might say. But most are reasonable places while they are with us - at least they do good beer.

"hole will bring to the patch of south east London and its impact upon"
http://www.wharf.co.uk/2014/05/deptf...new-local.html

After being gazumped by Camden Pubs and Bars at the Cheqiers in the Market, Antic have reached agreement to purchase the EMD Cinema near the top of the market that has been empty for years.
As there is now a brand new Cinema around the corner I would guess that planning permission for conversion to a pub would be a formality.

West Norwood - there are signs at the large High St location which used to be 'thisthatandtheother' suggesting that 'Knowles of Norwood' will be 'coming soon'.
Hmm, there was a similar promise at another site on Knights Hill, not long back, that didn't come to fruition.

"Our current proposals include the"
http://www.thisislocallondon.co.uk/n...include_homes/

They've also got the old cinema in Harlesden last called the Misty Moon. The cinema was called the Coliseum but in my school days was always referred to as the "bug hutch". I went to it as the Wetherspoon Coliseum over 20 years ago. Harlesden is such a dump that both Wetherspoon and Fullers have closed down pubs there. The nearest Spoons in Wembley is one of the worst in London.

Antic have bought Clarence and Fredericks brewery in Croydon.They are changing the name to Volden brewery.

"is coming to South Norwood and is close to securing a deal on an existing pub in the area"

http://www.croydonadvertiser.co.uk/T...ail/story.html

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Originally Posted by hondo

"is coming to South Norwood and is close to securing a deal on an existing pub in the area"

http://www.croydonadvertiser.co.uk/T...ail/story.html

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Could be useful for a pre match pint,wonder which pub they are talking about.

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Originally Posted by Bucking Fastard

Could be useful for a pre match pint,wonder which pub they are talking about.

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Well the Portmanor is currently closed, so that may be a possible..? Oddly, not listed here...

http://publicaccess.croydon.gov.uk/o...D_DCAPR_145990

Applicant Mr Antic London for one pub in Norwood.

http://publicaccess.croydon.gov.uk/o...D_DCAPR_147984

Looks more South Norwood but different applicant.

The second one is The Ship, campaign ongoing

https://www.facebook.com/groups/Save...pSouthNorwood/

" foyer of the former Granada theatre and EMD cinema is set to open for the first time to the public since 2003 with a pop-up pub today"
http://www.thisislocallondon.co.uk/n..._public_today/

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Originally Posted by hondo

" foyer of the former Granada theatre and EMD cinema is set to open for the first time to the public since 2003 with a pop-up pub today"
http://www.thisislocallondon.co.uk/n..._public_today/

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This seems to be a permanent fixture called the Mirth, Marvel & Maud. Despite the central location it only opens at 16:00 on weekdays. I haven't been there yet but added it to the site.

" may be the next local pub to undergo an Antic revival"
http://brockleycentral.blogspot.co.u...et-tavern.html

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Originally Posted by hondo

" may be the next local pub to undergo an Antic revival"
http://brockleycentral.blogspot.co.u...et-tavern.html

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They opened one in Peckham last week.John the Unicorn and the pictures on twitter lead me to think its one of their building site type pubs.

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Originally Posted by london calling

They opened one in Peckham last week.John the Unicorn and the pictures on twitter lead me to think its one of their building site type pubs.

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http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandst...ome-the-new-in

I read an article the other day and they mentioned that Antic have a Head of Design who said they source the furnishings from Ebay,markets,second hand shops and yes skips.Something I have suspected for a while.

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Originally Posted by london calling

I read an article the other day and they mentioned that Antic have a Head of Design who said they source the furnishings from Ebay,markets,second hand shops and yes skips.Something I have suspected for a while.

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It works.

"He added how a pint of ale would cost between"
http://www.croydonadvertiser.co.uk/8...ail/story.html

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Originally Posted by hondo

"He added how a pint of ale would cost between"
http://www.croydonadvertiser.co.uk/8...ail/story.html

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Saw this on Twitter last night. I'll probably pop along on opening night as it's only few minutes on the bus from my house.

Quite exciting times in Croydon beer-wise - this will be the borough's first Antic pub, in an area that has become an ale desert following the closure of the local 'Spoons.
After that, we can then look forward to a branch of the Craft Beer Co opening in the Box Park development next to East Croydon station at the end of October, alongside a seperate bar from the local Cronx brewery.
And then we have a second Antic venue which is scheduled to open in a seriously under-pubbed area (Norbury) in the new year. Happy days!