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View Full Version : What type of pubs should we include here?



Blackthorn
18-10-2010, 08:37
A simple enough question you might think, after all this is a pub review website so they should all be on here. That's fine for everyone's idea of a proper traditional pub, but what about those establishments that blur the boundaries a bit?

If the definition of a "pub" is as simple as an establishment that sells an alcoholic beverage for consumption on the premises without the obligation of buying food, that's fine and I'm happy to go with that. But that will include many places that aren't proper pubs in the traditional sense. Consider these examples:

1) Somewhere that's had a gastropub makeover, and is in reality now more of a restaurant.
2) Somewhere that actually calls itself a cafe, but nonetheless has a range of drinks on tap and you don't need to purchase any food.
3) A cocktail bar that serves no draft drinks.

I'd be interested to hear other people's thoughts, and whether there are any official site guidelines on this.

Thanks.

oldboots
18-10-2010, 09:16
New readers should start here (http://forums.pubsgalore.co.uk/showthread.php?560-What-should-be-included-on-PG).

I haven't changed my basic ideas but I'd be interested to hear other points of view.

Strongers
18-10-2010, 10:00
As oldboots has pointed out this subject has been exhaustively discussed and I think the general consensus is that any establishment that allows one access to alcohol without paying membership, an entrance fee or making the customer buy food should be included.

Blackthorn
18-10-2010, 10:47
Sorry, I should have searched out that previous thread. That's broadly in line with what I was thinking, I was just a bit concerned that a couple of the suggestions I had submitted might not be viewed as pubs.

Thanks for the help.

Strongers
18-10-2010, 11:47
Sorry, I should have searched out that previous thread. That's broadly in line with what I was thinking, I was just a bit concerned that a couple of the suggestions I had submitted might not be viewed as pubs.

Thanks for the help.

It's always good to bring up old subjects again and if everyone had to trawl through the madness that is discussed on this forum everytime they wanted to start a thread to check whether it has been mentioned before it would become very tedious.

Conrad
18-10-2010, 13:53
Yeah, I don't think anyone should feel the need to search before posting. Search is there for looking up things you remember to my mind. Discussing again is fine as new people new perspectives, and we change our opinions (at least I know I do).

Millay
19-10-2010, 08:43
Most things are acceptable in my opinion, although I've noticed a number of hotels listed that don't have public bars. Gastropubs, Bar, Cafe, Lounge etc. are all OK provided they have a bar where you can order drinks. When adding new pubs I always think you should have a contribution to make, a photo or preferably a review. I see no point in trawling through someone elses database and adding pubs that I've never been near and can't even be sure that they still exist. At the very least I will have walked past the place in the last month or so.

HTM69
19-10-2010, 13:55
Anywhere that is open to the general public and serves alcohol is fine in my book - again, that's the consensus of the majority here.

Al 10000
19-10-2010, 15:02
My criteria for for listing a pub on here or on my own lists is.

1: It must have a draught Beer on not bottles only
2:you dont have to pay an entry fee to get in
3:You dont have to purchase a meal to have a drink

If a pub passes all these then i am happy to list it.

:cheers: Alan.

NickDavies
23-10-2010, 19:31
My criteria for for listing a pub on here or on my own lists is.

1: It must have a draught Beer on not bottles only
.

If you did that you'd miss out places like Gordon's Wine Bar (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/64653/), which would be a dreadful shame considering it's an absolute classic.

RogerB
24-10-2010, 08:52
I have listed/reviewed a few football club bars (e.g. Dartford, Truro City, Kingstonian) where they are generally open at certain hours on non-match days and I am quite happy to see them on the site.

Some Arts Centres / Concert Halls have bars in their foyers that are open to the public (Festival Hall, Barbican & Kings Place to name but 3) and you can pop in for a drink without any conditions. They all sit within the generally accepted criteria but should they also be listed on PG?

Millay
24-10-2010, 09:45
Some Arts Centres / Concert Halls have bars in their foyers that are open to the public (Festival Hall, Barbican & Kings Place to name but 3) and you can pop in for a drink without any conditions. They all sit within the generally accepted criteria but should they also be listed on PG?

Good point Roger, I guess there may be other public buildings/amenities that could be included as well. My feeling is that if you've been there, had a drink and believe that there is something noteworthy or useful to say then add it to the site. What I can't see any point in is adding something without leaving a meaningful review or something that just says "Bar in the xxxxxx Museum". The site should be informative not just factual.

I really don't think it's something that's easy to put 'rules' around though. We've really got to leave it to the sensibilities of members, and of course Conrad and Dave will sanity check any new additions.

Al 10000
24-10-2010, 18:02
I have listed/reviewed a few football club bars (e.g. Dartford, Truro City, Kingstonian) where they are generally open at certain hours on non-match days and I am quite happy to see them on the site.

Some Arts Centres / Concert Halls have bars in their foyers that are open to the public (Festival Hall, Barbican & Kings Place to name but 3) and you can pop in for a drink without any conditions. They all sit within the generally accepted criteria but should they also be listed on PG?


I agree about those bars you mentioned but wine bars should not be on this site and i flagged up 2 Bella Itallias that were on the Norwich list they probably do sell beer but Conrad and Dave agreed with me and deleted these.
At the end of the day this is called Pubs Galore and not PG plus wine bars and restaurants galore.

Farway
25-10-2010, 08:56
I agree about those bars you mentioned but wine bars should not be on this site and i flagged up 2 Bella Itallias that were on the Norwich list they probably do sell beer but Conrad and Dave agreed with me and deleted these.
At the end of the day this is called Pubs Galore and not PG plus wine bars and restaurants galore.

I disagree, I think the basic premise of sells alcohol to anyone who walks in off the street without need to buy other goods or services is fine by me, this IMO includes wine bars

If the is finessed too much it will be only CAMRA approved, has to sell pork scratchings, no dimpled mugs, no settees etc etc

The final arbiters are of course Dictators Conrad & Dave

Conrad
25-10-2010, 12:43
We don't know what we are doing :)

RogerB
25-10-2010, 12:57
The final arbiters are of course Dictators Conrad & Dave

It is up to the individual using site to decide whether they wish to enter the listed pub/bar/off licence/restaurant/cafe/supermarket/park bench etc for a drink. I wouldn't pop in to a Cafe Uno for a drink whether it was listed on the site or not.

NickDavies
25-10-2010, 19:27
It is up to the individual using site to decide whether they wish to enter the listed pub/bar/off licence/restaurant/cafe/supermarket/park bench etc for a drink. I wouldn't pop in to a Cafe Uno for a drink whether it was listed on the site or not.

You never know. If you've been assigned the task of entertaining the mother-in-law and two ancient aunts for the afternoon you may well be delighted that you can get a beer (or possibly a large scotch) in a Cafe Uno.

Blackthorn
25-10-2010, 22:22
I agree about those bars you mentioned but wine bars should not be on this site.

The problem then though is that you have to define exactly what a wine bar is. I added a pub that actually calls itself a wine bar (The Courtyard Wine Bar) but it does nonetheless sell pints of real ale, which is more than can be said of many pubs. On the other hand I've also added a cocktail bar (that sounds like a pub - The Earl of Manvers) that doesn't sell any draft drinks. It was really that one that prompted my question in the first place.

I agree about the Bella Itallia though. If something's clearly a restaurant I would tend to say it probably shouldn't be on here, even if you can just pop in and have a drink. There's a Mexican restaurant in Bristol (Las Iguanos) that was on another pub review site, and I reviewed that since it was there, but I haven't bothered requesting it on this site.

Interesting point about bars within concert venues. I hadn't even thought of including those, which is a bit of a shame as I could have had a rant about Bristol Colston Hall's policy of decanting bottles of Corona in to plastic glasses, and charging you about £4 for the privilege!

Strongers
25-10-2010, 23:58
I would still stick with anywhere an alcoholic beverage of any kind can be consumed without an entrance fee or any other hidden charges.

PS. Lucy, now being off the bottom of the football prediction table feels she is allowed to pipe up about a pub not being a pub unless there are pint glasses behind the bar.

RogerB
26-10-2010, 09:19
PS. Lucy, now being off the bottom of the football prediction table feels she is allowed to pipe up about a pub not being a pub unless there are pint glasses behind the bar.

I would refer her to the Cask & Glass in Victoria. Until just a few years ago it only served beer in half pint glasses. It was (and still is) most certainly a pub although they do now have pint glasses. See my write up for details...

http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/22888/

NickDavies
26-10-2010, 20:25
Passing through Victoria this evening for what must be well over the 10,000th time (say 200 days a year x 2 each day = 400 x 25 years = 10,000) I noticed the JDW reckons it's a "Bar - Cafe."

I wonder how many punters are taken in by that. The evil things we do to our overseas visitors.

http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/images/display/23064_10d006ba0619d2dec9fc375aa7021e7f.jpg?w=2