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09-03-2021, 07:51
Visit the Shut up about Barclay Perkins site (http://barclayperkins.blogspot.com/2021/03/a-porter-and-stout-argument-part-two.html)
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-IWGs92MQXX0/YEZRKTfM62I/AAAAAAAAi0w/P25dgfvgaRsCY9FFWJ2SdGiP7ov-loslACLcBGAsYHQ/w326-h400/Fullers_London_Porter.jpg (https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-IWGs92MQXX0/YEZRKTfM62I/AAAAAAAAi0w/P25dgfvgaRsCY9FFWJ2SdGiP7ov-loslACLcBGAsYHQ/s600/Fullers_London_Porter.jpg)
Some more incoherent beer history fun. This time with the astounding claim that one element of three threads was Lager.
"Porter could be a hundred or more years older, and the first brewers to make it weren't necessarily the "biggest breweries in the world," but rather little pubs that served what they brewed on site, and they cut every cost they could before modern kilning techniques had taken hold anywhere. I don't necessarily have any investment in any of this info, but I kid you not (feel free to Google this), some historians say that porter was born from a beer called "Entire beer," which was essentially just a three-way mixture of lager, pale ale, and a strong ale. The three separate beers were poured into a single glass upon request, much like a "black & tan" is today. Anchor Brewing literally has this on their website. Again, I don't mean to imply I believe this, nor did I want to indicate that I thought anything you said is wrong, moreover, I believe all of us are wrong! LOL "Beer history is a funny thing," meaning, no one really knows any of this for sure, and every "historian" thinks they're the only one that's got the story right, yet they all contradict one another! I've resigned to just be fascinated by any story I hear, and I romanticize with whichever story sounds good at the moment. None of it matters."When I pointed out the first Lagers weren't brewed in UK until the 1840s, I got this reply:
""Porter was always a beer produced by big brewers because it had to be brewed on a large scale." Interesting. So, you couldn't make a five-gallon batch of it? Why is that, exactly? LOL Also, John Feltham wrote an article called "The Porter Brewery" in 1802, where he claimed porter was based on a mixed drink called "Three Threads," which was one-third ale, one-third "beer," and one third two-pence. Don't get mad at me for telling you this stuff. I'm only pointing out how rocky beer history is. Also, although lager didn't go by its current name in London till 1839, the people of Pilsen were making beer as early as the 13th century. František Ondřej Poupě wrote a book in 1794 about lager, so it's not like the world was waiting around for the UK to figure things out. Although the London porter is one of the most commonly cited early porter beers, let's not forget there are other countries on Earth, and Germans were brewing beer on American soil in commercial breweries as early as 1612. Dunkel and Swartzbier have documentation that go back to 1390. -and let's be honest here, a porter is just a variant of a Dunkel. The history of the porter as we know it is probably so muddled because it went through its own evolution on every continent. Just a thought. If you're comfortable being positive you know everything, hey, more power to you."
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Qf_rz13fhJ8/YEZRKn3UP-I/AAAAAAAAi00/Jb-FtGKrz4kpxU8yN9zts40PMB8HMDAMQCLcBGAsYHQ/w400-h266/Greussen_Deutscher_Porter%2B-%2BCopy.jpg (https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Qf_rz13fhJ8/YEZRKn3UP-I/AAAAAAAAi00/Jb-FtGKrz4kpxU8yN9zts40PMB8HMDAMQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1055/Greussen_Deutscher_Porter%2B-%2BCopy.jpg)
So they were brewing Lager in London in the 19th century, they just didn't call it that. And they were brewing Lager in Pilsen in the 13th century. Real comedy gold this. Then there's the killer - because they brewed dark beers earlier than 1700 in Germany, Porter must be derived from Dunkles or Schwarzbier. Right. Porter is any beer darker than a certain colour. There were beers that dark in Germany before 1700, so Porter must be derived from them.
I'm not getting mad for you telling me this stuff. I'm having a good laugh.
On a more serious note, it's scary how little weight facts and logic have with a lot of people. I was going to say nowadays, but I guess it's always been the same.
More... (http://barclayperkins.blogspot.com/2021/03/a-porter-and-stout-argument-part-two.html)
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-IWGs92MQXX0/YEZRKTfM62I/AAAAAAAAi0w/P25dgfvgaRsCY9FFWJ2SdGiP7ov-loslACLcBGAsYHQ/w326-h400/Fullers_London_Porter.jpg (https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-IWGs92MQXX0/YEZRKTfM62I/AAAAAAAAi0w/P25dgfvgaRsCY9FFWJ2SdGiP7ov-loslACLcBGAsYHQ/s600/Fullers_London_Porter.jpg)
Some more incoherent beer history fun. This time with the astounding claim that one element of three threads was Lager.
"Porter could be a hundred or more years older, and the first brewers to make it weren't necessarily the "biggest breweries in the world," but rather little pubs that served what they brewed on site, and they cut every cost they could before modern kilning techniques had taken hold anywhere. I don't necessarily have any investment in any of this info, but I kid you not (feel free to Google this), some historians say that porter was born from a beer called "Entire beer," which was essentially just a three-way mixture of lager, pale ale, and a strong ale. The three separate beers were poured into a single glass upon request, much like a "black & tan" is today. Anchor Brewing literally has this on their website. Again, I don't mean to imply I believe this, nor did I want to indicate that I thought anything you said is wrong, moreover, I believe all of us are wrong! LOL "Beer history is a funny thing," meaning, no one really knows any of this for sure, and every "historian" thinks they're the only one that's got the story right, yet they all contradict one another! I've resigned to just be fascinated by any story I hear, and I romanticize with whichever story sounds good at the moment. None of it matters."When I pointed out the first Lagers weren't brewed in UK until the 1840s, I got this reply:
""Porter was always a beer produced by big brewers because it had to be brewed on a large scale." Interesting. So, you couldn't make a five-gallon batch of it? Why is that, exactly? LOL Also, John Feltham wrote an article called "The Porter Brewery" in 1802, where he claimed porter was based on a mixed drink called "Three Threads," which was one-third ale, one-third "beer," and one third two-pence. Don't get mad at me for telling you this stuff. I'm only pointing out how rocky beer history is. Also, although lager didn't go by its current name in London till 1839, the people of Pilsen were making beer as early as the 13th century. František Ondřej Poupě wrote a book in 1794 about lager, so it's not like the world was waiting around for the UK to figure things out. Although the London porter is one of the most commonly cited early porter beers, let's not forget there are other countries on Earth, and Germans were brewing beer on American soil in commercial breweries as early as 1612. Dunkel and Swartzbier have documentation that go back to 1390. -and let's be honest here, a porter is just a variant of a Dunkel. The history of the porter as we know it is probably so muddled because it went through its own evolution on every continent. Just a thought. If you're comfortable being positive you know everything, hey, more power to you."
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Qf_rz13fhJ8/YEZRKn3UP-I/AAAAAAAAi00/Jb-FtGKrz4kpxU8yN9zts40PMB8HMDAMQCLcBGAsYHQ/w400-h266/Greussen_Deutscher_Porter%2B-%2BCopy.jpg (https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Qf_rz13fhJ8/YEZRKn3UP-I/AAAAAAAAi00/Jb-FtGKrz4kpxU8yN9zts40PMB8HMDAMQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1055/Greussen_Deutscher_Porter%2B-%2BCopy.jpg)
So they were brewing Lager in London in the 19th century, they just didn't call it that. And they were brewing Lager in Pilsen in the 13th century. Real comedy gold this. Then there's the killer - because they brewed dark beers earlier than 1700 in Germany, Porter must be derived from Dunkles or Schwarzbier. Right. Porter is any beer darker than a certain colour. There were beers that dark in Germany before 1700, so Porter must be derived from them.
I'm not getting mad for you telling me this stuff. I'm having a good laugh.
On a more serious note, it's scary how little weight facts and logic have with a lot of people. I was going to say nowadays, but I guess it's always been the same.
More... (http://barclayperkins.blogspot.com/2021/03/a-porter-and-stout-argument-part-two.html)