Supermarkets closing pubs down

[Al 10000]

I know of three pubs that Tesco have closed down or demolished and also one that Asda have pulled down and this is just in my local area.
I wondered if this is happening across the country.

[Dave M]

Yes that is happening to a pub near me in Bristol.

Tesco have planning permission to turn what was the beer garden on the Friendship Inn (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/368/) into a car park - but the council are being stubborn and refusing permission for signage and a cash machine.

[Farway]

Not round here, but maybe it would be a blessing to have a Tesco etc in their place for some pubs?

In my area there is a council [or is that "social housing"?] estate where the grotty pub is now closed, I would think the residents would be more than happy for a Tesco with lower grocery prices & no travel costs, to replace it

Not all pubs /shops / local butchers etc are Heaven sent and a drinker's /shopper's paradise, some are the pits and deserve to fail

[Al 10000]

If you look on pubs galore i have reviewed the Windsor Castle in Carlton Tesco want to pull this smart pub down to make a bigger car park.
They also pulled the Cow down in Beeston which was a very old pub and they converted the White Cow in Ilkeston into a tesco express.
I appreciate that some rubbish pubs are probably better closed,but i always think if its still standing a decent landlord might bring in a decent crowd of customers and bring the pub back up to a decent level or am i living in hope.

[Soup Dragon]

The Joker in Hamstead (B'ham) has just been converted to a Tesco Express and a pub in Aldridge was closed due to the kids drinking the beer, fortunately, they havent sufferes as the knocked it down and opened a Tesco on the same spot, selling the same kids, cheaper booze - you can't make it up, can you?

[Oggwyn Trench]

The Champion Jockey in Donnington(Telford) is now a Netto
The Thomas Telford in Leegomery is now a whole row of shops
On a slightly different tack the Shropshire Lad in Malinslee was demolished to make way for a medical centre
The Charlton in Oakengates was demolished for a Vets

[arwkrite]

The Joker in Hamstead (B'ham) has just been converted to a Tesco Express and a pub in Aldridge was closed due to the kids drinking the beer, fortunately, they havent sufferes as the knocked it down and opened a Tesco on the same spot, selling the same kids, cheaper booze - you can't make it up, can you?

The Joker is one of the few pubs in that area that I know of, its not to far from the sis-in-laws. Saying it had a bad name would be an understatement,.

[trainman]

I suppose the worse a pub is failing, the easier it would be for a supermarket to buy them out for 'redevelopment'. Many such pubs need to try quite a lot harder to justify existence, but any that are healthy community pubs should be awarded protection from the planners.

Rose&Crown, Crown Point, is surrounded by hoardings and allegedly due to become a(nother) Tesco Express. The area already has a convenience store a few yards down the road and 3 Supermarkets (incl Tesco Express at what used to be Jack Stamps) 2 bus stops away in W.Norwood. I've written to jdw asking them whether they had looked at the property - the area is desperate for a decent real ale outlet.

I find these 'Express' & 'Local' stores pretty awful - the choice is usually poor, though I'm lucky to have a pretty good local corner shop down the road.

[Rex_Rattus]

Thanks Trainman for the update on the increasingly dire prospects for drinking in West Norwood. I imagine The Hope is still the best bet. The Tesco/Jack Stamp used to be a decent Allied Breweries (Ind Coope) pub called The Thurlow Arms when I lived there.

We've lost the Toby Jug at the Tolworth roundabout on the A3, and I gather Tesco want to open a supermarket on its site, combined with the site of the now also demolished Government buildings there. With the Red Lion also gone, there is now no pub in Tolworth.

[trainman]

I imagine The Hope is still the best bet. The Tesco/Jack Stamp used to be a decent Allied Breweries (Ind Coope) pub called The Thurlow Arms when I lived there.


Yes, though I only pop in occasionally, Youngs & all that, though they did have a Titanic guest earlier in the year - Iceberg, I think, at reduced price.
Thurlow had a poor reputation (dodgy clientele) before it closed, Jack Stamps had a jdw-style customer base, but was cheap & ok, I thought.


, there is now no pub in ....

A grim start to a sentence for any village/town/district...

[Strongers]

Not round here, but maybe it would be a blessing to have a Tesco etc in their place for some pubs?

In my area there is a council [or is that "social housing"?] estate where the grotty pub is now closed, I would think the residents would be more than happy for a Tesco with lower grocery prices & no travel costs, to replace it

Not all pubs /shops / local butchers etc are Heaven sent and a drinker's /shopper's paradise, some are the pits and deserve to fail

Pubs don't fail, the owners and management fail and when one is demolished it means that it is gone for good and the slight chance of someone with a brain in their head taking it over and turning it around is gone forever.

[Conrad]

Seems as good a thread as any to post this on, but Tandleman did an interesting post on pub closures (http://tandlemanbeerblog.blogspot.com/2010/08/quality-thing.html) today.

[Farway]

Seems as good a thread as any to post this on, but Tandleman did an interesting post on pub closures (http://tandlemanbeerblog.blogspot.com/2010/08/quality-thing.html) today.

Yep, he seems to have summed up much better than me when I implied grotty and appaling pubs deservedly closing

I liked his coments in the last two paragraphs, especially paying top dollar for warm pint, frozen chips and no smile or greeting

I have just returned from Hungerford area, the pub we chose was the Swan Inn at Inkpen [review & pics to follow], a great place,a million miles from frozen chips and surly staff, and no doubt will continue to survive due to care & attention to customers wants. As Tandleman so eloquently puts it The pursuit of quality, service and choice has never been more important.

[Conrad]

... As Tandleman so eloquently puts it The pursuit of quality, service and choice has never been more important.
I think it omits the all important budget however, as I sit here and once again think of JDW's success.

[Al 10000]

Thanks Trainman for the update on the increasingly dire prospects for drinking in West Norwood. I imagine The Hope is still the best bet. The Tesco/Jack Stamp used to be a decent Allied Breweries (Ind Coope) pub called The Thurlow Arms when I lived there.

We've lost the Toby Jug at the Tolworth roundabout on the A3, and I gather Tesco want to open a supermarket on its site, combined with the site of the now also demolished Government buildings there. With the Red Lion also gone, there is now no pub in Tolworth.
Having read these posts the situation is worse than i thought it would be i think its about time that supermarkets stopped closing pubs down,there is more history and memorys in a pub than you will ever have in a supermarket or any other company that wants to shut pubs down.

[oldboots]

Although I agree with Tandleman that "... pubs need to up their quality game to have a chance of survival" I've never been entirely convinced that "many of the pubs that have gone were appalling in the extreme and at the bottom end of the market" as Tandleman and other bloggers (particularly ex Blogger Stonch) try to convince themselves. I think there's a fair amount of self deception going on here, - "it's just the bad or the badly run pubs that close". No I don't think so, many fine pubs, well run, profitable pubs have gone. Would anybody realistically say JDW offers a high standard of service? Yet they are the most sucessful pubco, opening pubs not shutting them. The harsh facts are that social changes have made us over-pubbed as a country (England), this coupled with dangerous neo-prohibitionist sucesses and legislative changes means there is more misery to come. Sadly I think we'll be down to 45,000 or even 40,000 pubs in a short time with more to follow.

[arwkrite]

I have said it before somewhere or other that big social changes caused by a great many factors are affecting pubs. The Health angle is hammered at you now from early schooldays, health agencies ,workplace rules and social norms according to who you mix with. Laws on Drink Driving are getting tougher. Pile on top the greed of pubcos and some managers , tenants and lets not forget the Govt in all its money spinning ways. We are in the middle of a long recession, dont believe the good news crap put out by our lords and masters. Snort enough white powder and anything looks good. Everyone is being squeezed financially it is only common sense people will look for a cheaper way to drink. Your pint , shot or bottle are luxury items by the price.I cannot blame people who like a drink looking elsewhere.Sad as closures are Joe Public does not owe the pub landlord, manager or Pubco Share Holders part of his /her income.

[oldboots]

Snort enough white powder and anything looks good.

Ah ha that's your secret......VIM :p

[arwkrite]

Ah ha that's your secret......VIM :p

Well it is supposed to send you round the bend:).........That crack is to old even for this forum. ( Crack ? get it? Gawd its like flogging a dead horse and I paid good money it. The joke that is not the Vim.).

[Conrad]

I have to admit I do wonder how much home entertainment has affected my drinking habits. When I first started drinking I was a student with a black & white tv - now I have a full sound system, dvd player, and colour viewing arrangement. So where before going down the pub was a good escape from the monotony of my room in a shared house, now a few bottles and a decent movie are all too easy and available.

[Alesonly]

I have to admit I do wonder how much home entertainment has affected my drinking habits. When I first started drinking I was a student with a black & white tv - now I have a full sound system, dvd player, and colour viewing arrangement. So where before going down the pub was a good escape from the monotony of my room in a shared house, now a few bottles and a decent movie are all too easy and available.
I must say for me its not done nothing for me. I have Computer linked sound & Large TV system I can view this site in 42in glory or watch anything direct on line. And I have most other entertainment things at home consuls Etc But I never Drink in doors on my own. I don't see the point of it So when I get a chance its straight down the Pub even if its just too watch football Or Cricket I would prefer too be in the Pub than at home.

P/s any excuse too get away form the wife. :whistle:

[Conrad]

When you put it like that I realise that I sounded like a johnny no mates, at the very least my wife will also be there (although she is happy enough to go to the pub). But frequently a couple of mates as well, not helped now I think about it by the fact that one of my best friends won't touch alcohol.

[ETA]

...one of my best friends won't touch alcohol.

But does that stop him coming down for the chat, entertainment and company, maybe even food? And it saves the worry about who's going to drive, should that be necessary.

[arwkrite]

It is very easy to become reclusive given a set of circumstances but I think if you are a naturally gregarious person you will go looking for company.Drinking is just one excuse. Knitting Circles, Choral Singing, Historical Re-Enactment or Adult Swinging Parties are some of the others.
I have all the modern home entertainment gizmos from the big plasma screen with Sky down to games consoles I haven't a hope in hell of ever mastering or getting beyond the first level. My favourites are the Internet because it suites my varied interests and my Dab radio BBB 5 ,Radio 4, and BBC 7. Honestly I would not miss the rest.

But nothing beats walking into a pub where you know the beer and the company are good. I rarely walk out of a pub thinking that it was a waste of time as happens when I fling the TV handset down in disgust and toddle of for another early night. May be it is my age group but I find my peers are happier meeting in a pub than in each other houses. There is the fact that may be older wives do not want a bunch of drunks messing up their orderly homes. ( No offence meant to to those long suffering ladies with a lot of years on their marriage licences ). A lot of older single blokes prefer to meet their mates on the neutral ground of a pub bar which is the great leveller. No Castles, Villas or Council Flats here .

[Conrad]

But does that stop him coming down for the chat, entertainment and company, maybe even food?
Sadly in this case, apparently yes. :muppet: