Why are most of new pubs/bars that open crap?

[Al Bundy]

Liverpool has seen a number of new pubs/bars opening in the last 12 months and the City Centre has seen the most. They are all, without exception, crap. And it hasn't got much better in Merseyside as a whole. Is it just here or are things just as bad everywhere else?

[london calling]

Depends on the type of pub you like.All the new ones I have been to in London tend to have a modern stripped out style with mostly craft keg and little or no cask beer.Suits me on both those things as I don't like traditional pubs that much and this has been the worst year I can remember for dud cask beer.Hate the prices of keg beer but if they do thirds I am okay with that.New pubs have to cater for the younger market so its going to be an ongoing problem really.

[Aqualung]

Liverpool has seen a number of new pubs/bars opening in the last 12 months and the City Centre has seen the most. They are all, without exception, crap. And it hasn't got much better in Merseyside as a whole. Is it just here or are things just as bad everywhere else?

Apart from micropubs and some brewery taps there are virtually no new pubs aimed at cask ale drinkers. Wetherspoons cater for cask drinkers but also food punters and families. The best "new" pubs are ones taken over by individuals or reliable chains like Black Country Ales. Greene King have turned some of their outlets into reasonable places whereas Marston seem to have completely lost the plot.

[Brainypool]

In the case of most new places opening in Liverpool, they're very much aimed at people that don't like pubs (or my idea of pubs, anyway). And that's an ever growing market. Seems to be as simple as that. Outside of the big cities, I like a lot of the new bars and pubs that are opening and doing good real ale. There are loads of them popping up near me around the Wigan and Preston area.

[sheffield hatter]

... they're very much aimed at people that don't like pubs (or my idea of pubs, anyway). And that's an ever growing market.

See my review of this pub (https://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/32005/) in Bridgnorth.

[london calling]

The Boak and Bailey blog on 30 th nov had a good article about the Swan with Two Necks in Bristol and the gentrification of this back street pub.Worth a read.

[Quinno]

How many will be with us in 10 years? Not many, I'd wager.

[NickDavies]

How many will be with us in 10 years? Not many, I'd wager.

The good ones will remain and the bad ones fail. As ever really.

[Delboy20]

Most people have an idea of what a good pub is. Most would probably agree that a "good pub" is a classic traditional pub with an open fire, decent ale, friendly landlord etc …
The sad fact is that these classic pubs can't be simply built or opened up. They develop over a number of years and many have fallen by the wayside never to return.
Most new openings (aside from micropubs) are in city centres and they are designed to cater for the city centre drinker (or eater!)
It's no secret that I will go in any "pub" and at least there are more openings now than a few years ago.
The harsh truth is that we will never replace what has been lost so we may as well embrace what we have.

[Mobyduck]

Most people have an idea of what a good pub is. Most would probably agree that a "good pub" is a classic traditional pub with an open fire, decent ale, friendly landlord etc …
The sad fact is that these classic pubs can't be simply built or opened up. They develop over a number of years and many have fallen by the wayside never to return.
Most new openings (aside from micropubs) are in city centres and they are designed to cater for the city centre drinker (or eater!)
It's no secret that I will go in any "pub" and at least there are more openings now than a few years ago.
The harsh truth is that we will never replace what has been lost so we may as well embrace what we have.

Well said Del, time moves on and you have to live for the day and what you have got to live with.

[Aqualung]

The sad fact is that these classic pubs can't be simply built or opened up. They develop over a number of years and many have fallen by the wayside never to return.


You've put into words something that crossed my mind as soon as I saw this thread. However, there's always the odd exception, Wigan Central (https://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/82614/) and The King Arthur (https://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/85733/) for example. The King Arthur had the Batham's Holy Trinity going on Friday, Mild, Best and XXX.

[Delboy20]

Thank god for the odd exception! The King Arthur is a great pub.

You are spot on with your comment on Black Country Ales opening good new pubs but they are usually conversions. I am looking forward to Seven Stars (https://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/63643/).

Also looking forward to The Colmore (https://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/86905/)

[Aqualung]

Thank god for the odd exception! The King Arthur is a great pub.

You are spot on with your comment on Black Country Ales opening good new pubs but they are usually conversions. I am looking forward to Seven Stars (https://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/63643/).

Also looking forward to The Colmore (https://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/86905/)

I'm looking forward to the Seven Stars more! Hopefully it will be a 12:00 opener so I can bypass the bonrshaker.
Digressing slightly, I read that the Stourbridge & Halesowen CAMRA branch is going to have their GBG allocation cut yo 10 making it an even bigger headache choosing the pubs. Meanwhile, other areas don't deserve the allocation they get eg: Aberdeen and large parts of London.