Speedy ROB [Archive] - Pubs Galore Forums

ROBCamra

04-06-2014, 07:08

A What Pub contributer who had been a little critical of PuG in the past, sent in an update to PuG and wrote in a forum - "Now lets see how long that takes!"

It was updated by ROBcamra in 7 minutes.

Well done ROB :notworthy::notworthy:

That long!!!! Damn I'm slipping. :evilgrin:

oldboots

04-06-2014, 08:24

That long!!!! Damn I'm slipping. :evilgrin:

Before that head gets too big you did get a bit of a kicking off another contributor to the same forum, regarding pubs in Staffordshire - no examples given so it's probably just more CAMRA sour grapes.

ROBCamra

04-06-2014, 08:48

Before that head gets too big you did get a bit of a kicking off another contributor to the same forum, regarding pubs in Staffordshire - no examples given so it's probably just more CAMRA sour grapes.

Is that the CAMRA forum by any chance?

I've only reviewed 8 pubs in Staffordshire, all in Burton I think. What was his gripe about those?

aleandhearty

04-06-2014, 11:14

AlanH

04-06-2014, 12:48

Yes, well done ROB. If it was a CAMRA thread Alan, which one was it ? I'd be curious to take a look.

The What Pub Yahoo group. (Thread - Competitors to What Pub)

oldboots

04-06-2014, 15:44

Is that the CAMRA forum by any chance?

I've only reviewed 8 pubs in Staffordshire, all in Burton I think. What was his gripe about those?

It's this:-

"my name is Robert, I am self opinionated, a member of CAMRA and live near Stafford I am not the robcamra who locates Staffordshire pubs in strange places and talks a lot of nonsense on the PuG Forum)"

he expands on this in a later post where he "reviewed" PuG alongside the others

"Pub Galore PuG). The main competitor to WP. Many former BITE contributors migrated here and it is quite vibrant. I don't like it, far too much up its own arse as far as I am concerned. Information is variable, it and reviews are often very out of date. As a quick check I compared listings for our area (WP 142 real ale pubs open[ish, varies almost on a daily basis], 4 non-real ale pubs and all the pubs that have closed since 1974). PuG have 14 closed pubs listed as open, 4 open pubs listed as closed and at least 19 pubs mislocated either on the map and/or in the area they are described as being in. I hope we are doing better than that."

He doesn't do a similar analysis of BITE or the lesser sites.

Gann

04-06-2014, 16:15

"my name is Robert, I am self opinionated, " Well we should invite his over then. He would fit in quite nicely...

"Pub Galore PuG). The main competitor to WP. Many former BITE contributors migrated here and it is quite vibrant. I don't like it, far too much up its own arse as far as I am concerned. .

Loved this comment :D And your average CAMRA branch isn't ???? Well all I can say is they much have changed since I suffered a few meetings in my local area..

ROBCamra

04-06-2014, 16:17

The What Pub Yahoo group. (Thread - Competitors to What Pub)

So a restricted forum of 141 members that we cannot be privy to?

AlanH, was there any reply to the chnges being done in a timely manner?

ROBCamra

04-06-2014, 16:19

It's this:-

"my name is Robert, I am self opinionated, a member of CAMRA and live near Stafford I am not the robcamra who locates Staffordshire pubs in strange places and talks a lot of nonsense on the PuG Forum)"

he expands on this in a later post where he "reviewed" PuG alongside the others

"Pub Galore PuG). The main competitor to WP. Many former BITE contributors migrated here and it is quite vibrant. I don't like it, far too much up its own arse as far as I am concerned. Information is variable, it and reviews are often very out of date. As a quick check I compared listings for our area (WP 142 real ale pubs open[ish, varies almost on a daily basis], 4 non-real ale pubs and all the pubs that have closed since 1974). PuG have 14 closed pubs listed as open, 4 open pubs listed as closed and at least 19 pubs mislocated either on the map and/or in the area they are described as being in. I hope we are doing better than that."

He doesn't do a similar analysis of BITE or the lesser sites.

Was this from the CAMRA forum, cause I can't find it OB?

AlanH

04-06-2014, 16:41

So a restricted forum of 141 members that we cannot be privy to?

AlanH, was there any reply to the chnges being done in a timely manner?

Yes, he did admit that he was impressed.

It started about 6 months ago when he complained that PuG was rubbish because two pubs had changed their name and one closed a while back and were not updated on PuG.
I checked the same town on WP and there was B----- A-- and asked why.
He said, "well we havn't got round to it yet as they are all keg."

He has added them all in the last few days.

oldboots

04-06-2014, 16:41

As Alan H said it's a Yahoo group which CAMRA members can ask to join.

I've just done a quick check on his closed pub figures and found that of the 14 he claims open on PuG but closed on WhatPub;
4 were already shown as closed (Wheatsheaf, Crown, Fox & Hounds, Watermill)
1 is shown as closed under its old name (Stafford Ale House)
1 is open under its new name (Sozzled Sausage/ Academy in Uttoxeter), Peter Ashworth took a photo of it looking very open on 1st April 2014.

The remaining 8 were still shown as open I've marked them all as closed and updated the names where required. I'll look for the 4 he says should be open if I get time.

bcfczuluarmy

04-06-2014, 17:15

With regards to WP and their info, once up together, will be more accurate as they have more people in the area. For example there are only 4 people on here, that I'm aware of, who review/visit pubs around Bristol. So we can only mark open closed if we pass them, read about a closure or get told about one. They also have closer relationships with those responsible/involved with pubs. For example a pub that was shut having an extension to it which I was convinced was going to disappear they knew it would reopen and part of the extensions were to form some B&B rooms which it has now.

They also, round here, have been slow to mark pubs reopened/shut and previously I sent them a list of pubs which they sent people out to confirm or deny. I did the same with Wiltshire on one pub and got a response back weeks later which by that point the pub probably had shut again. However I drove past 2 last night that looked shut but weren't marked as shut. I need to investigate before I update, if necessary, on here.

Regarding the map points I correct every pub that I've been to, and some not if perusing and spot it's wrong, or are on the list to do unless they are already correct obviously. I haven't check their accuracy in too much detail but I suspect they are not as accurate as the exact building where location is harder to determine but I may test the theory if bored at some point.

Still can't beat this site it's easier to navigate for one.

Blackthorn

04-06-2014, 18:47

For example there are only 4 people on here, that I'm aware of, who review/visit pubs around Bristol.

And I usually get it wrong having read it in an out of date Camra mag leaving Jon to correct me! :)

bcfczuluarmy

04-06-2014, 21:59

I think Bath & Borders Camra on WP are none existent they have pubs added but hardly a photo to be seen and lots of shut pubs still marked as open. I won't name them they can find them out on their own although they could just check here to get the heads up...

Rex_Rattus

05-06-2014, 10:31

Regarding the map points I correct every pub that I've been to, and some not if perusing and spot it's wrong, or are on the list to do unless they are already correct obviously. I haven't check their accuracy in too much detail but I suspect they are not as accurate as the exact building where location is harder to determine but I may test the theory if bored at some point.
.

I guess you are referring to PuG map points here and not WhatPub? We all know how relatively easy it is to correct map points here, but has anyone tried to do it on WhatPub? I have and I can tell you it's hard work. If anyone is ever interested in knowing how to report such changes I'll gladly let them have the benefit of my experience, but frankly I've now given up.

Certainly one London CAMRA branch used PuG data as the basis for their WhatPub database. At one meeting I was at they got it in the neck from someone not in their branch who considered PuG data to be not worth having. Clearly I knew more than he did about the value of PuG data and was able to put him straight, although he remained sceptical. It seem that some CAMRA members in positions of responsibility do tar PuG with the same brush as lesser sites.

As far as London is concerned, I've found both PuG and WhatPub of great value in providing updated info for each. In the small world in which I operate (OK, maybe London's not too small a world) both sites have benefited from the presence of the other.

Aqualung

05-06-2014, 18:17

As far as London is concerned, I've found both PuG and WhatPub of great value in providing updated info for each. In the small world in which I operate (OK, maybe London's not too small a world) both sites have benefited from the presence of the other.

I feel the same about Whatpub and as I've contributed to their site in a small way I don't feel any guilt about using some of their data here. The really big advantage Whatpub has over this site is the opening times. I would guess it would be beyond the scope of it to include them other than just part of the narrative where relevant.

Quinno

05-06-2014, 19:02

I feel the same about Whatpub and as I've contributed to their site in a small way I don't feel any guilt about using some of their data here.

I imagine there's rather a lot of cross-pollination, especially those Pubs Officers who uploaded their branch's data to WhatPub who also post here too :whistle:

Anyways the two sites are distinct - WhatPub is a 'listings +' website that is (or should) be more up-to-date than here, simply because in theory every CAMRA branch should know (at the very least) how many pubs they have and the current status (give or take a couple of months).

Whereas here we give a more rounded, personal and nuanced opinion of the pub itself based on our own travels. Something WhatPub doesn't (and if they have any sense, never will) do.

So the two can live happily side-by-side without too much toe-treading. I think...

Aqualung

05-06-2014, 19:09

Anyways the two sites are distinct - WhatPub is a 'listings +' website that is (or should) be more up-to-date than here, simply because in theory every CAMRA branch should know (at the very least) how many pubs they have and the current status (give or take a couple of months).

Whereas here we give a more rounded, personal and nuanced opinion of the pub itself based on our own travels. Something WhatPub doesn't (and if they have any sense, never will) do.

So the two can live happily side-by-side without too much toe-treading. I think...

Agreed, there was talk a while ago about user reviews and scores on Whatpub but it seems they have completely knocked that on the head.

gillhalfpint

05-06-2014, 19:11

I am happy using them both, as depending what I want to know, the answer comes from one or the other. Yes they can live side by side for me.

Quinno

05-06-2014, 19:20

Agreed, there was talk a while ago about user reviews and scores on Whatpub but it seems they have completely knocked that on the head.

Sanity seems to have prevailed. For CAMRA to run a site where people can comment in the negative about pubs would be akin to defecating on their own doorstep.

AlanH

06-06-2014, 13:39

I was quite amazed to see the What Pub link on each PuG pub!!

I wonder if What Pub will reciprocate and add a PuG link to form the ideal search duo?

Dave M

06-06-2014, 13:48

Very quickly spotted! Hope you don't mind Alan, I merged this back into this thread as I was about to mention it here

After reading some of the discussion in this thread about people using both sites I figured it might be useful to provide a quick link from PuG to WP.

At the moment it can only be seen by users who are logged into PuG, it certainly isn't there for every pub yet either.

If people find ones that haven't been matched up please don't send me a link in the normal way as that will get really confusing for me.

Also I'm not providing it to try to get links back from WP, there is no way they would do that, just want to make this site as useful as possible.

Quinno

06-06-2014, 18:30

Also I'm not providing it to try to get links back from WP, there is no way they would do that, just want to make this site as useful as possible.

Magnanimous :cheers:

Mobyduck

06-06-2014, 18:40

Well done Dave, it is very useful.

Dave M

06-06-2014, 19:41

Magnanimous :cheers:

Well as the two sites are providing something different and most people here are saying they use both then it seems like a sensible thing to have.

I'm not entirely sure how many I have matched up or the quality (some links will go to the wrong pubs on WP!). Will look into improving on that if users think it is worthwhile.

Still can't beat this site it's easier to navigate for one.

This was the comment that prompted me to release the links, I figure it is better that I encourage users to browse this site and let it lead them to what they want rather than the constant searching on WP.

Quinno

06-06-2014, 19:54

I figure it is better that I encourage users to browse this site and let it lead them to what they want rather than the constant searching on WP.

Indeed - and it's a lot easier to submit my beer scores after typing my review :D

Good work Dave!

aleandhearty

06-06-2014, 19:56

Magnanimous :cheers:

Well as the two sites are providing something different and most people here are saying they use both then it seems like a sensible thing to have.

Think you're being rather modest there Dave! I'm with Quinno. However, it's an excellent combination for pubgoers.

Strongers

07-06-2014, 00:46

What's what pub? %devil%

Lady Grey

07-06-2014, 09:32

The only problem is that some of the information on the What Pub site hasn't been updated. I've noticed a few supposedly closed pubs on What Pub, that have been reopened recently.

Rex_Rattus

07-06-2014, 10:48

The only problem is that some of the information on the What Pub site hasn't been updated. I've noticed a few supposedly closed pubs on What Pub, that have been reopened recently.
I assume you've submitted a feedback form to notify the branch?

The trouble is some CAMRA branches are so much better than others in keeping their info up to date. There's a branch with more pubs than members, and when you've got nearly 800 open pubs in your patch and only a handful of active members it is hard to keep track of everything that's happening to them. That's why they rely on people telling them when something's not up to date. But I have to admit to being a bit frustrated when I go to the trouble of submitting a photograph and writing up a pub and it doesn't get actioned.

Lady Grey

09-06-2014, 15:07

At the moment I'm not a contributer to What Pub, but I discussed it with my partner who is CAMRA member. He has given me permission to use his membership number to make corrections on the site. I hope people will not view this as a disloyalty to Pubs Galore.

Rex_Rattus

10-06-2014, 09:52

I hope people will not view this as a disloyalty to Pubs Galore.

I can't believe anyone would think that! Both sites currently have different, and equally valid, functions. It's a bit like having two pubs that you regularly use.

I must confess that I didn't realise that the WhatPub update function was only available to CAMRA members. Live and learn.

Aqualung

10-06-2014, 19:08

Both sites currently have different, and equally valid, functions.

I agree and refer to both sites and the GBG if going somewhere, but tend to be more influenced by the GBG unless there is something new in the area or a small brewer's tied house oh, and how could I forget, a Spoons!
It is frustrating when you submit something to Whatpub and don't hear anything for weeks, although the same happens here to a lesser extent but there is the Pending Approval feature which lets you see what is outstanding.

bcfczuluarmy

10-06-2014, 22:58

It is frustrating when you submit something to Whatpub and don't hear anything for weeks, although the same happens here to a lesser extent but there is the Pending Approval feature which lets you see what is outstanding.

Blasphemy. I've had a picture approved in less than a minute and nearly all 2nd generation map points corrected on here apart from a couple of recent ones. Wiltshire WP response I've managed to fully deweed the drive and wait for the weeds to grow again prior to getting an update/acknowledged. Bristol and Borders responded but doubted my input, on here nobody questions my suggestions.

This place allows for a more rapid response and better update of details generally without doubting or a general lack of response that they may eventually respond too.

Oh and don't get me started on Bath & Borders as it's tempting me to join CAMRA as nobody seems to have a clue there, maybe as Rex_Rattus says they may be a area short of members with a lot of pubs to keep on top of.

Aqualung

11-06-2014, 07:37

Blasphemy. I've had a picture approved in less than a minute and nearly all 2nd generation map points corrected on here apart from a couple of recent ones. Wiltshire WP response I've managed to fully deweed the drive and wait for the weeds to grow again prior to getting an update/acknowledged. Bristol and Borders responded but doubted my input, on here nobody questions my suggestions.

This place allows for a more rapid response and better update of details generally without doubting or a general lack of response that they may eventually respond too.

Oh and don't get me started on Bath & Borders as it's tempting me to join CAMRA as nobody seems to have a clue there, maybe as Rex_Rattus says they may be a area short of members with a lot of pubs to keep on top of.

I did say "to a lesser extent" and was not complaining!
I had a map correction and a couple of new or amended pubs outstanding for well over a week (I didn't make an exact note of how long).
With Whatpub some North London pictures I sent took a month while East London stuff hasn't had anything done. Other London branches have been good with their response.

Lady Grey

11-06-2014, 09:45

I must confess that I didn't realise that the WhatPub update function was only available to CAMRA members. Live and learn.

I don't think the update function is restricted to CAMRA members, I tried clicking on the link provided on the pub details page, but it is non functioning at the moment. Perhaps I should try to contact the CAMRA branch directly.

AlanH

11-06-2014, 13:21

I don't think the update function is restricted to CAMRA members, I tried clicking on the link provided on the pub details page, but it is non functioning at the moment. Perhaps I should try to contact the CAMRA branch directly.

I have received several "non member updates" via the Email link, but this is not as good as the member "Submit update" link and as it says above, was "non functioning" on my last check (not giving an email address to send to). I will contact What Pub admin.

UPDATE - I have received a couple of replies saying "working for me, you must have a local software problem."
You must have the same problem as me!
Has anyone else tried the non-member email update?

Al 10000

11-06-2014, 16:07

I did say "to a lesser extent" and was not complaining!
I had a map correction and a couple of new or amended pubs outstanding for well over a week (I didn't make an exact note of how long).

[QUOTE=Aqualung;65662]I did say "to a lesser extent" and was not complaining!

Ive got two new pubs to add to the site which have been waiting since 28th Feb and 1st March 2014,but i am not complaining,they will get added in time,they are closed pubs so i will wait and see when they appear on the site.

The Admins on this site helped me out quite a lot when my son first joined me up to it (i would'nt have the faintest idea how to join a site like this ) so i have no problem if they are struggleing to get things done.

On a happier note my next crawl will get me past the 11,000 pubs done.
.

Al 10000

11-06-2014, 16:13

Not sure what went wrong there,my quote now seems to be from Aqualung and not me,

just goes to show how thick i am at useing ths site :confused::(

Mobyduck

11-06-2014, 20:22

Not sure what went wrong there,my quote now seems to be from Aqualung and not me,

just goes to show how thick i am at useing ths site :confused::(
You are not alone :D

bcfczuluarmy

11-06-2014, 22:59

Has anyone else tried the non-member email update?

All my updates to the various local groups have been done via email as a none member you're not worthy/turn our nose up at you approach. The issue I had was making my Outlook become my Hotmail so the emails actually got sent as it automatically opens outlook to send the email.

sheffield hatter

12-06-2014, 07:08

Ive got two new pubs to add to the site which have been waiting since 28th Feb and 1st March 2014,but i am not complaining,they will get added in time,they are closed pubs so i will wait and see when they appear on the site.

All my added pubs have been actioned, except for some closed ones, so it looks like Dave is taking a pause on closed pubs (for policy reasons?). He did get this one (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/81904/) actioned just half an hour after I submitted it. That's got to be some sort of record.