Is that pub all that?

[Mobyduck]

Some pubs have big reputations,the question is are they justified?Liking a pub or not is obviously down to personal preference but could be affected by circumstances on the day e.g unlucky to catch the end of a barrel or a rowdy stag party happens to have taken over the bar on your visit spoiling the atmosphere.A few examples from my experience are-
The Harp,Charring cross , great pub great reputation and totally justified in my view,
Ye Olde Mitre ,Holborn ,Big rep yet Iv'e visited on several occasions and never been satisfied with the outcome,either average beer, or great difficulty in being served e.c.t.Although agreed a good looking pub.
The Wenlock Arms always divided opinion some thought it a tip others mecca,I veer towards the latter,
The Evening Star ,Brighton,great beer good pub yet I prefer The Great Eastern down the road as a pub altough it doesn't come close in the beer stakes.My examples are southern based, but what are your experiences in your neck of the woods? Could be controversial.:evilgrin:

[oldboots]

The Bree Louise would be my nomination for the most over-rated pub, I can't think of better example of dross that's been talked up so much.

Usually I've found the high reputations are deserved, I'm thinking about pubs like the Brunswick in Derby or the Marble Arch in Manchester and so on.

[gillhalfpint]

The Wellington in Birmingham has a great reputation and is one of the pubs to visit while in Birmingham.

The Anchor in Digbeth is another must visit pub with a good reputation, but where I rate the Anchor best for new brewery beer choices I rate the Wellington better for keeping the beer condition right.

The newer kid on the block, the Post Office Vaults in New Street has fewer beers, but kept in good condition and a must for anyone into foreign beers.

[Soup Dragon]

The Wellington in Birmingham has a great reputation and is one of the pubs to visit while in Birmingham.

The Anchor in Digbeth is another must visit pub with a good reputation, but where I rate the Anchor best for new brewery beer choices I rate the Wellington better for keeping the beer condition right.

The newer kid on the block, the Post Office Vaults in New Street has fewer beers, but kept in good condition and a must for anyone into foreign beers.

It all comes down to personal taste and the time of visit (if a one time visit is the basis of a review, of which mine usually are). I am a Midlander that likes a head on his beer, which i seldom get at the Welly or Vaults and the quality of the Hobson's MILD varies enormously at the Anchor. Why the Lamp in Digbeth is rated, i will never know. Quite why Ember Inns and Spoons places make the GBG is beyond me too, as their pubs are so erratic.

I am just about to review the Swan With Two Nicks in Worcester - Quinno likes it, OB doesn't - it was great at my visit, but then i am miserable and liked the fact nobody was in - i think i would hate it later in the day. Unless we are talking about Ingoldmells, i tend just to write a somewhat benign account and say what i see.

[Mobyduck]

Quite why Ember Inns and Spoons places make the GBG is beyond me too, as their pubs are so erratic.
I have to agree with the above,I guess they are there simply on the amount of different beers they provide,a good idea but if their is a problem with consistent quality, which has been my general experience, then the idea is not so good.Which leads me to the same conclusion as oldboots regarding the Bree Louise.

[Thuck Phat]

Just Beer Micropub (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/74151/) in Newark has had a lot of positive publicity but I found it to be hugely overrated and couldn't find anything I wanted to drink there.
And for the controversial pick, I was a little disappointed by the Brunswick in Derby which, whilst a lovely pub with a wide range of ales, seems to choose guest beers which don't overshadow its own, fairly dull in my experience, range. By contrast the Smithfield in Derby had one of the best ale selections I've ever seen, a great shame it's closed - what do I know?

[Al 10000]

The Beacon Hotel in Sedgley is meant to be one of those great pubs,well i dont think so the pub was rammed at 2.45 on a Saturday dinner so they decided to call time and chuck everybody out,pubs like this dont deserve any custom in my opinion.

The Brunswick in Derby is one of those well known pubs and i have been in this pub 100s of times,i find the pub ok during the day but in the evening it gets a crowd who hog the bar and wont move out of the way unless you are in their click this really *isses me off.

I tend to prefer bog standard pubs that dont get crowded out with people looking for a great pub with loads of different beers on.

[Bucking Fastard]

The Beacon Hotel in Sedgley is meant to be one of those great pubs,well i dont think so the pub was rammed at 2.45 on a Saturday dinner so they decided to call time and chuck everybody out.

Good job you weren't there on Mon-Thu when it closes at 2.30pm.;) This is one of those pubs which maintains the old fashioned tradition of closing in the afternoon,times advertised in the Good Beer Guide and on their website.

[Strongers]

The Euston Tap may be marvelous for the beer tickers among us, but as a pub it is uncomfortable and often cramped. It isn't a place that I would want to spend more than an hour in.

[Millay]

The Euston Tap may be marvelous for the beer tickers among us, but as a pub it is uncomfortable and often cramped. It isn't a place that I would want to spend more than an hour in.

I have given up on the Euston Tap, its just too much effort, a victim of its own success. And thats why i am currently sitting the Doric Arch ;-)

[Oggwyn Trench]

The Boathouse in Shrewsbury allways gets in those 100 pubs you must visit lists but if it was not for the location it would just be another very average pub .

Of my local pubs the Crown is allways in the running for local CAMRA pub of the year despite lagging well behind the Station and Fighting Cocks across the road in both choice and quality of beer .

[Mobyduck]

The Euston Tap may be marvelous for the beer tickers among us, but as a pub it is uncomfortable and often cramped. It isn't a place that I would want to spend more than an hour in.

Interesting comment ,the Euston Tap is still on my to do list and i'm quite keen to get there soon,I understand it's quite small but so is the Harp When it's rammed, but never had a problem getting served,ok you may have to stand outside at times when busy but always a pleasure to be there. Maybe the Tap doesn't have the same allure ,hopefully I'll find out soon. :cheers:

[gillhalfpint]

I always like to look into the Euston Tap when changing trains. Had a wander upstairs last time we were in. Maybe we are always there when it is quiet, but that is how we like to do our pubs. Hate it when they are rammed. I like to look round a pub in peace.

[Spinko]

I usually find the Briton's Protection in Manchester a bit bland. I think it's the memorable and evocative name that makes people like it! Though I did have a very nice beer in there the other day! With Knott Bar around the corner as well...

The other one similar is the Scarbrough Hotel just outside Leeds Station. Their beer selection tends to be very staid. There's even more competition in Leeds with the Hop, Cross Keys, and Foley's 5 mins walk away.

In contrast I've rarely heard many people outside of beer circles in Yorkshire talk about the Grove in Huddersfield, and I'd class it as one of the best pubs I've visited, for beer quality, choice, price and friendly atmosphere.

[Quinno]

The Bree Louise would be my nomination for the most over-rated pub, I can't think of better example of dross that's been talked up so much.

I second that one sir. A genuine 'how does that get into GBG?' pub. And I am well-qualified to ask that, as Pubs Officer and GBG co-ordinator for the Reading & Mid Berks branch (cue flurry of questions about why Pub X in Reading isn't in - I will happily tell you!)

I also found The Devonshire Cat (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/55761/) to be well-overrated on my visit. I am intending to get back there in August so we'll see if I change my mind.

[trainman]

I second that one sir. A genuine 'how does that get into GBG?' pub. And I am well-qualified to ask that, as Pubs Officer and GBG co-ordinator for the Reading & Mid Berks branch (cue flurry of questions about why Pub X in Reading isn't in - I will happily tell you!)

I also found The Devonshire Cat (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/55761/) to be well-overrated on my visit. I am intending to get back there in August so we'll see if I change my mind.
I'll third that emotion re Bree Louise - to be highly commended for trying to take the real ale route, but serving everything so flat aint gonna have folk flocking back.

I dropped the Devonshire from recent tour; very good beer range but a bit spoonsy (apart from viw of tap room, iirc). 'Well-overrated' may be slightly harsh and it would be on-map during a 2-dayer, but others take priority on flying visit.

Britons Protection, Spinko; you may feel the beer range is bland for you, I can understand that, but one could hardly apply that term to the pub itself - an outstanding survivor in an age where heritage pubs have been lost forever due to moronic 'designers' who have probably never set foot in a proper pub in their lives!

[Spinko]

I also found The Devonshire Cat (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/55761/) to be well-overrated on my visit. I am intending to get back there in August so we'll see if I change my mind.

In any other city it would be the stand-out pub but in Sheffield it'd only just make my top ten!

[Mobyduck]

Might divide opinion here,Wetherspoons,of the ones Iv'e ever been to I can only think of one I'd be ok about revisiting ,The Gatehouse in Highgate,Listening to others I would be prepared to try the Crosse Keys in Gracechurch Street,never made it yet always find my way into The Swan over the road.In general I think they are rather poor,how so many are in the Good Beer Guide I don't know,smacks of cosying up. That said there are many I haven't been in but enough to make my mind up. :whistle:

[Quinno]

I think they are rather poor,how so many are in the Good Beer Guide I don't know,smacks of cosying up.

Unfortunately, despite prompting from HQ, a lot of CAMRA branches still do GBG selection as a kind of 'who do we like this year' thing than actually use raw data (beer scores).

We regularly have one (and sometimes two) JDWs in our allocation of 18. If they appear, it is because their scores bear comparison with the other 16/17. Whether that is true of places elsewhere, I do not know...!

The issue with JDW is that, because they promote staff from within, it's unusual to get a sustained period of management continuity. And because the 2013 GBG is released in 2012 based on scores from 2011*...well I'll let you lot work out the logic.

* - Yup. I know and I agree that something must be done about!

[Mobyduck]

...well I'll let you lot work out the logic.

* - Yup. I know and I agree that something must be done about!

Regarding CAMRA logic, My local The waggon and Horses,The Waggon and Horses (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/59679/) , was CAMRA North Hants pub of the year 2012,and runner up last year and yet failed to appear in the last G.B.G's yet was a regular before that,but will return next year, it appears to be where the pub is ,i.e. available votes and not how good the pub /beer actually is.:confused:

[Soup Dragon]

I ask myself the same question, why do Spoons and Embers so frequently get in the GBG? It is kind of up there with UFOs, ghosts and the Loch Ness Monster. I have done a fair few of them, as i will visit near any pub. The quality in these places fluctuates enormously. I have had good pints in them, but have had as many poor ones. I believe that the answer to many mysteries will evetually be proved in time, but somehow i think this one is beyond mortal man.

[Quinno]

Regarding CAMRA logic, My local The waggon and Horses,The Waggon and Horses (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/59679/) , was CAMRA North Hants pub of the year 2012,and runner up last year and yet failed to appear in the last G.B.G's yet was a regular before that,but will return next year, it appears to be where the pub is ,i.e. available votes and not how good the pub /beer actually is.:confused:

Has there been a change of licensee? General policy is to pull a pub if there is a change of licensee with no discernible track record of GBG history. We had to do it to The Foresters Arms (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/61565/) the other year. We knew that the new landlady was a good egg but the proof of the pudding etc.

With Spoons, we know that the beer policy and external checks will always remain in place regardless of management. Even so, we rather favour those with continuity and low staff turnover, like The Baron Cadogan (JD Wetherspoon) (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/56820/)

[Mobyduck]

Has there been a change of licensee? General policy is to pull a pub if there is a change of licensee with no discernible track record of GBG history. We had to do it to The Foresters Arms (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/61565/) the other year. We knew that the new landlady was a good egg but the proof of the pudding etc.

With Spoons, we know that the beer policy and external checks will always remain in place regardless of management. Even so, we rather favour those with continuity and low staff turnover, like The Baron Cadogan (JD Wetherspoon) (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/56820/)
Same Landlord for 35 years (sign of a good pub) The issue is I believe , Because the pub comes under North Hampshire CAMRA ,A rather small branch,the Waggon and Horses is right on the border between North Hants and Surrey/Hants borders ,a much larger branch and public transport being what it is nowdays there isn't the through traffic of members using it on a regular basis to vote . May be barking up the wrong tree,but it seems rather strange.:confused:

[oldboots]

Same Landlord for 35 years (sign of a good pub) The issue is I believe , Because the pub comes under North Hampshire CAMRA ,A rather small branch,the Waggon and Horses is right on the border between North Hants and Surrey/Hants borders ,a much larger branch and public transport being what it is nowdays there isn't the through traffic of members using it on a regular basis to vote . May be barking up the wrong tree,but it seems rather strange.:confused:

The size of a neighbouring branch shouldn't make a difference, the pub will be in a particular branch's area and that branch will make the decision be it based on beer scores, mates of the landlord, state of the runes etc. Sadly the beer scoring system isn't used enough by members to be useful and objective. There also seems to be a built in bias for GBG pubs within the scoring system (more visits - more scores), the same effect can be seen on pub review sites, I perceive a connection between scores/number of reviews and being/been a GBG entry.

Which branch the pub is in is a rather weird aspect of CAMRA and best not delved into by mere mortals. :eek:

[Pubsignman]

While we're on the subject of long standing GBG regulars dropping out of the guide for a while - does anyone know why the Blue Anchor in Helston, which had been in every edition of the guide until a few years ago, dropped out for one year recently? Was it a change of ownership?

[Mobyduck]

Which branch the pub is in is a rather weird aspect of CAMRA and best not delved into by mere mortals. :eek:
Amen to that. :pray:

[Spinko]

Which branch the pub is in is a rather weird aspect of CAMRA and best not delved into by mere mortals. :eek:

I'm interested.. :o

I'm amazed there's no Manchester city centre branch.

[gillhalfpint]

Re the Blue Anchor.

We think beer quality went down. Believe there is a new brewer in there now and the for the last 2 - 3 years the Spingo has been brilliant again. We were in there supping it after our walk to Porthleven today. Great beer. There are more beers out now too and rumour is they may need to expand.

[Wittenden]

Which branch the pub is in is a rather weird aspect of CAMRA and best not delved into by mere mortals. :eek:

Yep,out here in the boondocks it's to do with bus routes and leylines.

[Mobyduck]

The Palm Tree in Mile end was always a pub I enjoyed going to ,not for the beers which although no usual suspects ,fail to excite,but for the pub itself with its slightly eccentric feeling of timewarp in the interior and pleasant setting on the exterior.But after yesterdays antics as documented in Strange goings on at the Palm Tree on Chit Chat, I may not return.:(

[Mobyduck]

Went to The Old Bull & Bush (http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/23743/) a couple of years ago for a bit of history,what a load of rubbish this place is ,never again.

[General Staal]

Quite why Ember Inns and Spoons places make the GBG is beyond me too, as their pubs are so erratic.

If all Embers and Spoons got in, I would agree. However, some are much better than others. The Queslett in Sutton Coldfield is an Ember clone pub, yet the beer quality and service is uniformly excellent. They also do not have the 'usual suspect' ales on all the time and their range changes. The Bishop Vesey in Boldmere is a Spoons, but again, the beer is very good and I never have a complaint about it.

The pubs in Birmingham that have a very good reputation that I would disagree with are:

The Anchor in Digbeth. I can see why people like it, but I find it unfriendly and the beer is hit and miss.
The Lamp in Digbeth, or is it Highgate? This is a very friendly pub, but again, the quality of the beer is really erratic.

I love the Post Office Vaults in Birmingham City Centre. The beer is excellent and it has a warm, friendly atmosphere.
I do like the Wellington, but it gets very full and cramped and lacks atmosphere, in my opinion.
Across in Hockley (Jewellery Quarter) the Lord Clifden and the Red Lion deserve their reputations - excellent pubs!

In Sutton Coldfield, the Station and the Duke have very good reputations. I can't see why the Station is so special. The Duke is a good old boozer and the ales are well kept, but the range is unadventurous and expensive. The King's Arms in Sutton, in my opinion, is by far the best pub. The Theakston's Mild is excellent and the service is second to none.

The Station in Whitby has a good reputation and well deserves it. Ale, atmosphere and service are all excellent. The Black Horse Vaults is also excellent as is the Endeavour. However, many of the pubs in Whitby are expensive, but well worth doing a crawl of.

[Andy Ven]

I love the Post Office Vaults in Birmingham City Centre. The beer is excellent and it has a warm, friendly atmosphere.


You may be interested to read this review from one of our local celebrity beer bloggers, Marverine Cole aka Beer Beauty: http://www.funf-media.co.uk/beerbeauty/index.php/2012/08/05/the-post-office-vaults-birmingham-review/

[General Staal]

The Post Office Vaults is top. I was doing a recce of a historical walk I am leading for my rambling group and I finished early. I decided to pop into the Vaults at 2:00 for a swift pint. I staggered out four hours later after trying the foreign bottled beers, which I have nver done before. I also got chatting to the landlord and the people from another local bar who had popped in after their shift.

A lovely place!

[gillhalfpint]

We have been in the Post Office Vaults 3 times this week. Is an early contender for pub of the month.

Doing a crawl of Leicester and Dudley this week, Egham USC next week, then Peterborough the week after. We finish with a week near Durham so will likely get a crawl round there plus Newcastle, so some iconic pubs on the itinary this month.